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308 Brass
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 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 09:47 PM
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rnew2000
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Got some range brass. Can't figure out if it's 308. New to reloading 308. Tried sending picture but said it was to big.



 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 09:51 PM
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rnew2000
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One head stamp reads HXP-83, the other reads RG on bottom and at about 2 o'clock it looks like 06



 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 10:28 PM
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12semi
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Trash any range pick up brass you are not sure of and even then you exercise a lot of care.  Fingers wriggling on the ground and not on your hand make a memory you won't soon forget. 

New brass is available. 
https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item/00198308win100/starline-rifle-brass-308-winchester-100-count

Once fired brass is available.  Do not buy crimped primer brass

here is some Hornady brass      
https://brassmanbrass.com/product/21y-308-winchester-hornady-100-ct/

I hope you got small-base FL sizing die.  If not, okay, but next time.....

I can't find my link to Federal brass,   its on Gunbroker.


When your post is sitting there, don;t keep hitting the enter button.  Once works fine, there's a thread someplace. 


 




 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 10:42 PM
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Charley



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RG is Radway Green,(Royal Ordnance Factory) English make. Not sure about the 06. Could be year, could be 30/06.
The HXP 83 is Greek manufacture. Never used their 7.62x51, but their 30/06 brass is very good quality.
Even knowing who made it, you don't know the history of the individual cases. Unless you have experience loading rifle ammo, I'd follow the advice from 12 Semi, and toss it. Much cheaper than a new rifle and surgery.



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 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 10:56 PM
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rnew2000
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Thanks for the info. I do reload for 223 and use some range brass. Think I'll stick with new brass and my own reloads. On average how many reloads can you get out of brass.



 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 11:06 PM
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Charley



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Just like anything else, "It depends". Sounds like BS, of course, but really does depend on your rifle's chamber, your die's dimensions, your load pressure levels, your reloading practices, and several other factors.



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 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 11:06 PM
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swampratt
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If you know how to inspect and measure the cases to the ninth I see no harm in using range brass..It is about all I use.

30-06 and .308 are different lengths..I hope you have dial calipers or some means of measuring.

On average I can get 15 reloads from 308 winchester cases and 40+ reloads from most other brands in .308.
This is with 42gr varget and 165 gr pills.

Now if you set the shoulder way back (say .007") then you will get about 8 reloads from the winchester.

Push the shoulder back Zero to .001" at the most for best case life.
To measure shoulder set back you can buy a tool or just place an empty pistol case on top of the brass and measure before and after resizing and adjust the die accordingly.

Pistol case of course needs to contact the shoulder in the middle or close.

You can always save it until you feel you are up to the task of using it.
Or make ink pens from them.



 Posted: Tue Jan 10th, 2017 11:56 PM
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STIHL
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Make sure it's boxer primed and not berdan primed, before you try to size it. If you decide to use it. If it's berdan primed it's scrap brass in my opinion.

Swampratt, can you elaborate on that a bit more about setting the neck back. You use the same pistol case and measure from head of rifle to head of pistol between caliper jaws. And set it back just far enough to easily chamber in your rifle correct? I guess you do it in reverse and the brass will start getting tighter? Just making sure I understand my mind is right on that.



 Posted: Wed Jan 11th, 2017 12:04 AM
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TMan51
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rnew2000 wrote:
On average how many reloads can you get out of brass.

As Charley states, that's a big "it depends".

I have 50rds of .30-30 brass that has seen regular use in three different rifles over a couple decades.
I once cycled 200rds of Remington .38 Special for three seasons of slow fire spot leagues. Practice and points. (dozens of times)

I sold a .30-30 that had a max size chamber that killed brass in 3 cycles of medium hot loads. Most of the 7mm Magnums I owned killed brass after 5 cycles.

On average, with a good sturdy case like the .308 or .30-06, (and all of their offshoots), unless you're really stretching the envelope, 15 cycles is not unusual.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 11th, 2017 01:54 AM
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Charley



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I forgot to mention the RG brass, being from the UK, is likely Berdan primed. Shine a light down the case, if Berdan, you will see two (or sometimes three) flash holes.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 11th, 2017 11:41 AM
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swampratt
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STIHL you got it correct.
I use a 40 S&W case and it contacts the shoulder a tick below this inverted flare nut.

Notice the line or lines on the case that i used a sharpie so you can see the wear mark.
The upper line is the Nut where it contacts.
The lower line is from the fired 40 case.
Those 2 lines are touching each other making 1 fat line,, so either way works .

Measure the entire length before resizing and then after resizing to see how far back you bushed the shoulder.

I do not do it to make the round chamber easier, I do it for consistency and to extend case life.

If you set the die one time to push the shoulder .003" back and then another time it pushes it .0005" then by all means the case is not the same dimension. accuracy can suffer.

If you change shell holder you will see a change I have 3 Lee #2 shell holders 2 measure the same and one is .002" different .

Hear is a picture to explain it all.



Attachment: shoulder set back 001.JPG (Downloaded 148 times)

Last edited on Wed Jan 11th, 2017 11:43 AM by swampratt



 Posted: Wed Jan 11th, 2017 12:33 PM
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STIHL
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Excellent I thought that was what you meant. I understand the less "working the brass" you do the better off you are. I need to set all of my bolt gun dies like this. It's been on the to do list but I have not got that far. It takes quite a while to get everything dialed in and you learn something new every day.



 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 02:28 PM
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Ragnar
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Once you have fired a round, wouldn't a neck sizing die work and accomplish the same? The case was formed to the chamber upon firing. So just the neck needs to be resized and the case deprimed.

I have about 10 reloads in my 308 brass thus far. I've been keeping my range pickups separate from by once fired brass. I'm using up the range brass first.

Either way, all brass gets inspected rigorously throughout the reloading process. I once almost reloaded 308 case which had a slice at the base of the case from a lawn mower. I had resized and primed it. But before loading powder I caught it. Could have been a disaster if I actually fired it.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 02:37 PM
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Damannoyed
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Ragnar, you never get to completely ignore body sizing.

I full-size every case, but I feed an autoloader, and I size the case as little as possible.

Even the bolt-action guys who "neck-size only" have to full-length size the body every few shots, 4-5 maybe, because the body, while it "springs's back' away from the chamber, only shrinks a %, and that reduces every shot. Very shortly, the case is basically chamber-size, and cannot be jammed into the chamber again.



 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 02:52 PM
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swampratt
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I put the neck sizing theory to a test.
Sure enough first fired of course little bit of growth.
2nd firing and Neck sizing only case grew .0005" then
third time it grew .0005 and same for #4. and # 5 necksizing it grew a bit less.

 After the 5th or 6th firing the case was hard to chamber but would chamber .
And all the way to the 20th time neck sizing this case it chambered the same as the 5th time.
Case growth in length  was down to .0005" about every 2 shots.

If you want to keep the case exactly the same size I feel you will need to fire them 5 times and neck size only.

Here is a theory I have.
Having a case that tight against the chamber wall allows ZERO cushion for shock.
I feel a little under sized from the chamber absorbs shock from the initial primer  or powder ignition and may help to control the bullet as it leaves the case.

I could be way off base with this theory.



 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 05:02 PM
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Ragnar
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You are both correct...I have a bolt action in 308 and my personal experience is similar in that at about the 5th firing the round was hard to chamber, but would. At that point I did a full resizing.

As a side note...Once the outdoor ranges open I hope to measure the impact of case length on velocity and accuracy. The theory is it ultimately affects neck tension on the projectile, so what's the impact on accuracy and velocity. Trimming is a lot of effort. Is it worth it? I'm testing trimmed case lengths of 2.005, 2.010, and 2.015.



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 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 05:30 PM
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Ragnar
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swampratt...interesting theory. Alternatively, being a little undersized from the chamber may cause vibration of the case when fired to affect the bullet as it jumps from the case mouth to the lands. A case firmly seated in the chamber becomes, in effect, one with the chamber. The projectile simply needs to fly straight out of the case and thru the barrel.

Either way, these factors are miniscule and who knows how much influence they have.

Here's another article on how to set the shoulder back. Going to give this a try at home.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2007/07/tech-tip-poor-mans-headspace-gauge/

Last edited on Wed Jan 18th, 2017 05:49 PM by Ragnar



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 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 07:59 PM
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If its on the ground it stays on the ground unless I know the source of the brass,,



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 Posted: Wed Jan 18th, 2017 08:25 PM
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swampratt
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That is the way I feel about Chevrolet's built after 1979.
I do not want them in my yard.
I really do not want any V6 front drive stuff.



 Posted: Mon Jan 23rd, 2017 06:19 PM
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The Dutchman
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If you're not sure what it is or the age and number of firings, I'd pitch it. Aint worth taking the chance!IMHO



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