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Varget Substitute
 Moderated by: Slingshot, Rockydog, klallen, DesertMarine, -6 Page:    1  2  Next Page Last Page  
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 Posted: Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 08:04 PM
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sirtallstuff
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Joined: Wed Sep 14th, 2016
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Not sure if I am the only one with this issue.... but ALL the data and reviews I read for 223 bolt action says Varget, Varget, Varget.... when I go to buy the stuff it is ALWAYS sold out!

So my question is.... what else do people recommend for 223 rem besides Varget?



 Posted: Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 09:15 PM
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2nd Post
Paul Tummers



Joined: Mon Jun 18th, 2007
Location: Berg En Terblijt, Netherlands
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Because there hardly is Varget available over here, we use VV N130.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 09:54 PM
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olyeller
Master Handloader


Joined: Sun Nov 22nd, 2009
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Hodgdon site lists 16 different powders for the 55gr SP bullet:

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle

You'll likely find a fan for each powder here on The Bench. Some swear by one or the other 4895's, others like H322 or H325, IMR4064, or BL-C(2), or......ad infinita.

See what's available in your area and give a couple a try. Paul suggests one that is not a Hodgdon; there are many to choose from. Don't overlook the Western brand powders (RamShot and Accurate); they have some very good choices, too.

It's more a matter of availability than suitability.

Last edited on Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 09:57 PM by olyeller



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 Posted: Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 09:55 PM
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rainyday
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Joined: Fri Apr 16th, 2010
Location: Marysville, Washington USA
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I use aa2230 in my 223 with a 50 or 55 grain bullet and get great accuracy



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 Posted: Fri Mar 3rd, 2017 10:42 PM
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Ozark Ed



Joined: Mon Jan 30th, 2012
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There are a bunch of powders that can be good in 223. I've used Benchmark, BL-C(2), AA2230, Varget, CFE 223, and H322.



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 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 12:29 AM
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Rockydog



Joined: Tue Jul 26th, 2005
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I have loaded a bunch of IMR4895 in .223 under both 50 and 55 grain bullets. I have also used IMR 4198, CFE223, IMR8208 XBR, and IMR 3031. All provided good performance.

For heavier bullets one of the most accurate powders was IMR4064 but you have to have a lot of patience to reload it. Its rather long stick shape is hard to get through the .223 neck. Couple that with compressed loads for most applications and it can get time consuming to load. A powder measure is a no-no. Funnel pouring with a swirling motion of the scale pan stacks it in cases like cord wood and it's then fairly easy to get enough in.

For all around best accuracy my pick would have to be H322. Small kernels, easy to load, and reasonable pressures at max make it a favorite. The bug hole groups seal the deal. RD



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Light hunting rifles; Gravity is permanent, recoil is temporary.Your Choice


 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 12:43 AM
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runfiverun
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4064 is pretty much the original varget.
they just ball powdered it for better metering.

cfe-223 is a click slower than varget and can give better velocity's.
H-335 is the military equivalent.
and AA-2230 is right in the same ball park.



 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 05:18 PM
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HighBC
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Joined: Tue Jun 21st, 2016
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I'm not a competitive shooter, but I do a lot of range and varmint hunting. The powders I like and use a lot of have been Varget of course, BLC2, 8208XBR, 4895's, 4064, on and on and on the list goes.

There's always something on the shelf that will perform well, so my advice would be to pick one and start developing.

HBC



 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 06:08 PM
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trouble
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Cabelas has 8 lb kegs for $232.99 right now plus the $20  haz mat fee.  They currently have free shipping on order over $99.00. They also have 1lb jugs for $33.00.

Last edited on Sat Mar 4th, 2017 06:10 PM by trouble



 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 09:00 PM
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papajoe222
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I've been using H4895 and actually like it better for use in temps below 40.
It measures out almost identical to Varget with very similar velocities and pressures. Cost is within $1 around here. Varget and H4895 are both abundantly available in my area.



 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 09:26 PM
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lscraig1968
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I have very good results with IMR 4064 and IMR 3031 pushing 55, 60, and 62 gr bullets.

All three weights turn a prairie dog inside out pretty as you please!



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 Posted: Sat Mar 4th, 2017 11:17 PM
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dadajack
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Reloader 15 is one of my favorites for the 223. Very good energy density, and excellent accuracy.



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 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 12:38 AM
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Rockydog



Joined: Tue Jul 26th, 2005
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trouble wrote:
Cabelas has 8 lb kegs for $232.99 right now plus the $20  haz mat fee.  They currently have free shipping on order over $99.00. They also have 1lb jugs for $33.00.


Recobs Target Shop had 8 pound jugs of Varget at $184.29 right now. One pounders are $26.89 but are out od stock today. Hazmat is $32 nationwide for UPS, $15 in the upper midwest in areas served by SpeeDee delivery. $0 for me, I carry it out the front door. :dancing: RD



____________________
“Those that beat their rifles into plow shares will plow for those who didn’t”. Jefferson

Light hunting rifles; Gravity is permanent, recoil is temporary.Your Choice


 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 02:50 AM
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Nanook
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dadajack wrote:
Reloader 15 is one of my favorites for the 223. Very good energy density, and excellent accuracy.

Yep, for a while in IL the High Power guys were mostly using RL-15. They used to order it by the pallet load.

I haven't seen them too much lately, but it's still a very good powder.

I like Varget when I can get it, and it seems more available lately. At least in my neck of the woods.



 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 05:05 AM
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dadajack
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Varget for the 308 and 223 is kinda like H4350 for the 6.5 Creedmoor and x47 Lapua in that I usually never get the best accuracy or velocity with it in any combination I try. I always seem to get accuracy AND velocity with RL-15, 16 and 17 though. I hope they come out with a RL-14 to match RL-15 burn rate, energy density, and bulk in a temp sensitive formula. I hate working up loads in a nice comfortable 60 degree environment, then backing off that load for the inevitable 107 degree summer weekends. It's even worse now using a suppressor.



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 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 06:49 AM
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BigDog58
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My local shop carries IMR 4166 and claims it is very similar to Varget (they also have Varget in stock). The owner says that a couple of his competition guys have tried it, with satisfactory results.

I like Varget, because I gt lucky last year and found 16 lbs of the same lot number



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 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 09:31 AM
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trouble
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Recobs Target Shop had 8 pound jugs of Varget at $184.29 right now.
Holy smokes!!! That's a good deal. I already have about 30 lbs but I feel like I should buy more at that price.



 Posted: Sun Mar 5th, 2017 12:32 PM
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SeabeeChief
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Joined: Sun May 13th, 2012
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My AR and bolt gun both like H-335 and CFE 223. Neither rifle likes Varget



 Posted: Mon Mar 6th, 2017 02:32 AM
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swampratt
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My bolt gun likes a load of varget at 17 F outside temp with 60 gr v max .. get to 50 F temps and forget about small groups.

H4895 for my .223
I have to weigh every charge on a beam scale even with ball powder..It is a disease I have.



 Posted: Tue Mar 7th, 2017 03:55 PM
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sirtallstuff
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Joined: Wed Sep 14th, 2016
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olyeller wrote:
Hodgdon site lists 16 different powders for the 55gr SP bullet:

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle

You'll likely find a fan for each powder here on The Bench. Some swear by one or the other 4895's, others like H322 or H325, IMR4064, or BL-C(2), or......ad infinita.

See what's available in your area and give a couple a try. Paul suggests one that is not a Hodgdon; there are many to choose from. Don't overlook the Western brand powders (RamShot and Accurate); they have some very good choices, too.

It's more a matter of availability than suitability.


Thanks for the info... I just don't like how Hodgdon data is for 1 specific bullet. I like to see load data for the exact bullet and powder I am going to use.

Is it fair to say that a 55gr V-max does not equal 55 gr Sierra HP or SP?



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